tuning blades and the picoboard

[fr8ycat]

Hey guys,

Can anyone recomend a set of tuning blades other than what Ikarus offers?

And are there any alternatives to the picoboard? Like the all in one setup of the picoboard but wondering if anyone has used anything else similiar with good results.

I Have the picolo Fun & Eco Picolo V.2. FP

[aymenpicc]

Hi fry8cat, I don't really have that much info about tunning blades; just wanted to let you know that there is some other types of tunning blades other than the Ikarus ones, there is a Carbon Fibre blades that are out there for the piccolo; I think they increase stability; I can't remeber what excatley they do; but they improve the performance; I will get back to you on where you can get them for.......

Also, There is an alternative to the ikarus piccoboard; once again I don't have enough info; but I am sure there is many alternatives; there is an option where you get mix controllers & reciver,etc & put them together.....

I know this reply didn't really help; but at least it is an assurance that there is what you are looking for; its just my info/memory is not good

thank you
aymenpicc

[_Buzz_]

Aymenpicc, I believe you're both right and wrong at the same time. When you were around before, carbon blades were being made by Rob Lee and their main advantage was a higher head speed and greater stiffness, but I do know that Rob stopped making them and subsequently sold the moulds. I can't remember who it was who bought them, but I also believe this individual has  stopped making them too. There are other blades available for use with the Piccolo both with and without having to modify them, but I don't really know what they are. The real Piccolo guru's like Paul Goelz and JJ are the guys to contribute here. As for the Picco board, there are now several on the market...virtually one for every Piccolo clone there is and as far as I know they are all very similar in all aspects except price. They run downwards in price from the Picco board.
If anyone was to contemplate the "seperates" route then I would have to say they would be far better using a cdrom motor too in order to gain the power required to offset the increase in weight.

[JJ]

Hi fr8ycat. I'm still using some Piccoboards, so can't comment from experience on an all-in-one alternative.

The best blades I've had so far are the Kyosho M24 Caliber blades. You need to turn the head faster as they need over 1400 rpm to hover. Bolt straight on to a Pic head. They work nice outdoors even if it isn't calm, I've flown up to about 10mph wind but that was hard work   The blades are rare over here, maybe you can get them easier where you are.


http://homepages.enterprise.net/jayjay/blade_mods.htm

[nnranger]

Assuming that you're looking to tuning blades to make it more stable?

To pull an idea out from a few years ago (from the masters, not from me )... have you ever cut your blades?  I fly my piccolo with the "V" cut, which shortens and narrows the blades.  The general idea is that it requires more speed to fly, and a higher head speed on the Pic results in a more smooth flight.

[fr8ycat]

Thanks for of your input.

Yea I guess it was Rob lee's blades I was reading about on Paul's site. I guess I forget how dated some of the info paul wrote about is but most of it is still very much relevent and I used his tips for the setup of my first Pic Fun and continue to go back to his site when I have questions or problems. It's a great resource.

Need to buy replacement blades and was wanting to try some tuning blades but also not really ready to part with alot of money for em. Haven't tried the cutting technique and not sure if it's something I feel comfortable doing.

As for the Picoboard I have the Plus vers. with HH. On my original Fun it took very little adjustment to setup and was very stable. On my Eco V.2 with the direct drive tail I've been having trouble getting it to be as stable. Also had to re-solder the red lead that goes from the picoboard to the tail motor so I'm stuck on what could possibly be the problem.
My solder job , older picoboard having probs with li-po's, HH module or picoboard NG or any combination of the above. Guess I need to do a "process of elimination"

Definitely want to stay away from "seperates", have had a hard enough time just getting the picoboard and my receiver positioned in what little space and support I have.

sorry for edit, mixing up lee and field's

[nnranger]

I'm at work and don't have the file in front of me, but when I get home I'll send you the picture for the v-cut.  Since the pic blades are plastic, you can cut them with an exacto or other razor knife pretty easily.  This particular mod was used by a lot of folks on the Ikarus forum "back in the day", and I've used it successfully for at least 50 flights.

Regarding the Piccoboard, give Paul an email via his site.  He used to be in the Piccoboard diag and repair biz, and he fixed mine several times after hard -ahem- non-standard landings     He was always courteous, quick, and reasonable, and I have no problems recommending him to others!

[nnranger]

Here are the directions for the V-cut

[fr8ycat]

Hey JJ, actually have your page saved from a Piccolo search I did a few months ago on the Net. The Kyosho blades, found this for now, are theese them?

http://www.toyhaus.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=TH&Product_Code=KYOCA1015&Category_Code=kyopahpepcm24

Also how do I achieve the 1400rpm head speed? currently using the 310 motor which I imagine might not cut it.

nnranger, thanks for the info. Have an extra set of stock blades and will probably give the v-cut a go.

[fr8ycat]

I guess I might be looking at the head speed issue the wrong way. Not necessarily achieving but maintaining is probably the better term. It sounds like 1400rpm is higher than the head speed with stock blades to maintain a hover?

[JJ]

Yes they are the ones  

The stock Pic hovers with a low head speed, 1000 rpm + or - some depending on the heli and weight. It works and keeps the damage down, but is just enough for control.
Cut blades or Hornet or M24 blades have less pitch and camber, so need to be spun faster. The faster disc gives benefits in control, gyroscopic stability and forward flight.
Go too far with the blades and the stock motor will get to its maximum rpm and not lift. A mild change has benefits without changing the motor or gearing.
To get enough rpm with the likes of the M24, Hornet or severely cut blades you can change the gearing (something like a 13 tooth motor pinon instead of 9 may be required). It may get hot pulling this gearing
You can change the motor. The efficient but fragile Orion Elite is fast enough, nearly 3000 rpm/volt instead of 2000. I rewound a stock 295 and that works, it needs something like 45 turns. Beware of going too hot a motor, or more powerful, as a big dose of throttle can burn the Piccoboard FET.
Or you can up the voltage. Going from 8 x NiMH to a 3 cell LiPo is enough for quite a hike in rpm. Watch the motor temp though, I used to fly a stock 295 for 10 minutes on a 1200 pack then let it cool off. Once cool it was ready for another 10 minutes. Also the Piccoboard wasn't originally designed for 3 cells. Check on Paul's site for which ones are most vulnerable. I've had no trouble - yet!
Sorry if you've read this stuff already, the bottom line is the head needs to spin faster with low-lift blades, to get the effect we want.

[fr8ycat]

JJ @ Sat Feb 17, 2007 2:48 am wrote:

Yes they are the ones  

The stock Pic hovers with a low head speed, 1000 rpm + or - some depending on the heli and weight. It works and keeps the damage down, but is just enough for control.
Cut blades or Hornet or M24 blades have less pitch and camber, so need to be spun faster. The faster disc gives benefits in control, gyroscopic stability and forward flight.
Go too far with the blades and the stock motor will get to its maximum rpm and not lift. A mild change has benefits without changing the motor or gearing.
To get enough rpm with the likes of the M24, Hornet or severely cut blades you can change the gearing (something like a 13 tooth motor pinon instead of 9 may be required). It may get hot pulling this gearing
You can change the motor. The efficient but fragile Orion Elite is fast enough, nearly 3000 rpm/volt instead of 2000. I rewound a stock 295 and that works, it needs something like 45 turns. Beware of going too hot a motor, or more powerful, as a big dose of throttle can burn the Piccoboard FET.
Or you can up the voltage. Going from 8 x NiMH to a 3 cell LiPo is enough for quite a hike in rpm. Watch the motor temp though, I used to fly a stock 295 for 10 minutes on a 1200 pack then let it cool off. Once cool it was ready for another 10 minutes. Also the Piccoboard wasn't originally designed for 3 cells. Check on Paul's site for which ones are most vulnerable. I've had no trouble - yet!
Sorry if you've read this stuff already, the bottom line is the head needs to spin faster with low-lift blades, to get the effect we want.

Very helpfull, thanks JJ.